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File: 1620073994257.jpg (108.5 KB, 828x824, chief keef ps4.jpg)

pic unrelated Chewy!MUSIC.FbVY (ID: 0e8f48)Country code: bug.png, country type: customflag, valid:   529313

Lately my Mom has been getting into the "philosophy" of how "everyone deserves love" and "we should be able to accept that there is good and evil within everyone, people are not one-dimensional, etc." and that supposedly "everything you hate about someone else is a projection of something within yourself" or something along those lines.

I kinda think it's a load of BS tbh. The idea that we should validate genuinely awful people by assuming they have good within them as well just seems like a convenient way to excuse awful behavior. Ex. "Oh that guy Ted Bundy who murdered young women and raped their corpses? We shouldn't hate him, it's not so black and white, surely there was good within him too!"

She compared it to how I often assert that you can separate art and artist when you have a musician, director, etc. who has been accused of heinous crimes or abuses, but I don't think it's quite the same thing. People forgive artists or ignore their faults if they make art that touches tons of people. (Most) serial killers, rapists, terrorists, etc. are not artists. They have no value as human beings. They serve only to commit atrocities that there is no reason to forgive.

This kinda ties into another issue I have with the seemingly common idea of "everyone deserves a basic modicum of respect". On one hand I kinda understand the point, but on the other hand I think respect should be earned. If I've just met you and you come across as a buffoon as soon as you start talking, why do you deserve my respect?

tl;dr: there is no tl;dr, if you want to engage in the thread just read it.

Maroon Auburn!QEUQfdPtTM (ID: 201d82)Country code: gb, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529314

File: 1620075398260.jpg (27.41 KB, 600x600, tfw.jpg)

I mean end of the day 'good' and 'evil' are just manmade concepts that mean nothing in nature or reality. I mean, is a cheeta evil when it goes and rips apart a bison? Is a tornado evil for ripping through someones house?

Jiggle!Dick2STbYY (ID: 95ccc2)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529316

File: 1620075569977.jpg (69.86 KB, 744x1075, toriel_useless_flowers_by_arin…)

"Fuck theirs, got ours" shall be the whole of the law.

Nothing is universal.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529317

>>529313
>This kinda ties into another issue I have with the seemingly common idea of "everyone deserves a basic modicum of respect". On one hand I kinda understand the point, but on the other hand I think respect should be earned. If I've just met you and you come across as a buffoon as soon as you start talking, why do you deserve my respect?
So, I think this might be the result of confusing two different senses of the word "respect".

From https://www.dictionary.com/browse/respect :

"""
3. esteem for or a sense of the worth or excellence of a person, a personal quality or ability, or something considered as a manifestation of a personal quality or ability:
Example: "I have great respect for her judgment."

4. deference to a right, privilege, privileged position, or someone or something considered to have certain rights or privileges; proper acceptance or courtesy; acknowledgment:
Examples: "respect for a suspect's right to counsel"; "to show respect for the flag"; "respect for the elderly".
"""

In so far as all people have basic human rights, they deserve respect in that regard (sense 4 above). But they don't deserve unearned respect in sense 3 above.

Snowbell (ID: edcae7)Country code: pittsburgh.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529319

File: 1620076728679.png (110.39 KB, 486x534, 83265 - artist-blackfeathr art…)

Your mom is going through a phase of "Live, Laugh, Love" hippy mom philosophy. She may grow out of it or she may start buying crystals and hoarding cats in which case you may have to give her the Old Yeller treatment.

You might also try introducing her to some real philosophy so she has a chance to grow out of the painfully shallow hippy-dippy bullshit.

Chewy (ID: 0e8f48)Country code: ponychan.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529328

File: 1620078908886.jpg (503.1 KB, 870x1000, 1601367701523.jpg)

>>529314
Technically true, but I think attempting to establish general ideas of good and evil are beneficial for keeping order in our s o c i e t i e s, even if ultimately there is a lot of subjectivity to it.

>>529317
I don't disagree here.

>>529319
She already has a ton of crystals 😨

Snowbell (ID: edcae7)Country code: pittsburgh.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529355

File: 1620083884940.png (3.31 MB, 1050x825, 82246 - Glock_17 gun luna.png)

>>529328

Then you know what you have to do...

Trac­er Bulle­t (ID: 8641de)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529356

File: 1620084063472.jpg (118.64 KB, 529x424, 1u0nqb0kqaao.jpg)

Typical empathy.

Macaroni!RevGiOKgRo (ID: d4038e)Country code: pittsburgh.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529357

File: 1620084670403.jpg (44.65 KB, 613x771, 68bb7222b6cf4a5edba6c4e2f3f121…)

>>529314
None of those are innately good or evil, but they might be inconvenient to our purposes, and so it follows that we best serve ourselves by containing or removing such things.

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529376

File: 1620089749959.jpg (71.14 KB, 640x360, wrongdoing.jpg)

>>529313

There's a lot to unpack here so I'm going to take it bit by bit.

>"everyone deserves love"


"Deserves" is a loaded term, so is "love". It's usually an empty platitude thrown out by people who want to sound like a hippie.

Nobody "deserves" love, but you could argue that showing compassion and understanding to all people would lead to better outcomes generally speaking than hatred or disregard.

>The idea that we should validate genuinely awful people by assuming they have good within them as well just seems like a convenient way to excuse awful behavior


They are still human beings. Trying to dehumanize even the worst of us is a vain attempt at denying our nature. The truth is all people are capable of doing terrible, horrifying things under the right (or wrong) circumstances. Trying to deny the humanity of murderers, rapists, terrorists, etc is a defense mechanism people use because they prefer not to believe their neighbors or even themselves could do such things. It's just not comfortable to think about.

Maybe instead of dehumanizing them to pretend that they are something "other", we should recognize their humanity for what it is: a low point. Instead of hate, maybe the people you perceive as so beneath your contempt should be pitied, because who really knows what led them to end up as a degenerate form of humanity, of squandered potential.

>They have no value as human beings. They serve only to commit atrocities that there is no reason to forgive.


Are people incapable of change? Having done some terrible things in one's life means that all their potential to do anything else is just gone? If that's the case, why not just kill such people immediately? Why bother with prisons or rehabilitation? But if you think someone has any capacity to change, you have to acknowledge their potential to do something positive.

>This kinda ties into another issue I have with the seemingly common idea of "everyone deserves a basic modicum of respect". On one hand I kinda understand the point, but on the other hand I think respect should be earned. If I've just met you and you come across as a buffoon as soon as you start talking, why do you deserve my respect?


In a civilized society, everyone ought to show "basic" respect in the interest of smooth operation and civility. This is more aptly named "politeness" or "courtesy". Nobody says you need to like or show favor to everyone, but there's no reason to go out of your way to be belligerent when an interaction can be perfectly neutral.
This post was edited by its author on .

Chewy!MUSIC.FbVY (ID: 0e8f48)Country code: bug.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529382

>>529376
>Trying to dehumanize even the worst of us is a vain attempt at denying our nature. The truth is all people are capable of doing terrible, horrifying things under the right (or wrong) circumstances.
>The truth is all people are capable of doing terrible, horrifying things under the right (or wrong) circumstances.
>under the right (or wrong) circumstances.

This is exactly the thing, though. Self-defense or general survival situations are different than an unprovoked violent crime that the assailant feels no remorse for and is pre-meditated. It gets to a certain point where excuses like "Well they had a shitty childhood, well they were bullied" and stuff like that doesn't cut it because TONS of people deal with that and don't turn into the next Charles Manson or something.
The average civilian does not just wake up one day and say "I'm going to murder someone." It's just not something that spontaneously happens. So even though they are "capable" of it, in a literal objective sense, it does not make sense to compare them to people who actually do those kinds of things. It's kind of the same thing as saying "Well technically this building is capable of collapsing unexpectedly" like yeah technically it's true but it's not gonna happen without a ton of external pressure.
This post was edited by its author on .

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529383

File: 1620091951499.png (819.32 KB, 1173x657, tied up at the moment.png)

>>529382

>This is exactly the thing, though. Self-defense or general survival situations are different than an unprovoked violent crime that the assailant feels no remorse for and is pre-meditated.


You have to wonder what lead them to be that way. Not many people just turn on a dime for nothing.

I think you should take a look back in history and see the countless examples of "normal" people doing god awful things in a short period of time. The point being that you don't know why they do what they do.

If it's a shitty childhood or other life circumstances, that is a legitimate factor, one that often is accompanied by many others. it isn't an excuse, but it is part of a larger explanation. Again, that should be a source of pity, not hate. Things could have been different, and that missed opportunity is something to regret.

And if someone was so mentally broken from birth that they would do such things, that is again a reason to pity them. They will never know what it is to live a normal life.

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529384

File: 1620092205899.png (678.73 KB, 1181x662, smoothbrain.png)

Essentially, when you end up with such examples of people, it is the result of any number of regrettable failures, somewhere, at some point in time, that were likely avoidable or mitigated if everyone were to show compassion, understanding, and dare I say "love" instead of the endless number of alternative harmful responses most people do every day without thinking twice.

Guarantee? No. Nothing is guaranteed and life is not deterministic. But we can try. I see no value in hatred for anyone. It does nothing for you that a clearer mind won't do better, and it does nothing to change the object of your hate.

Macaroni (Mobile) !RevGiOKgRo (ID: a8d7b5)Country code: pittsburgh.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529385

File: 1620093718336.jpg (18.83 KB, 224x369, article-0-03E98603000005DC-166…)

>>529384
You must realize of course that some individuals are, at least in actual practice, beyond salvation and only their containment or destruction can stop the harm they inflict on others, right?
We can pity such people, but we have to also stop them with whatever force the situation calls for, should they be so mind-warped as to seemingly lack the very faculties that would make self-control and repentance possible. I would sooner charge that if hatred has a provable basis, a specific target, and the situation is too deep for alternatives, it may well be pragmatic to feel such an emotion.

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529386

File: 1620093975570.png (631.02 KB, 1183x659, awkward.png)

>>529385

>You must realize of course that some individuals are, at least in actual practice, beyond salvation and only their containment or destruction can stop the harm they inflict on others, right?


I never said there weren't. I don't claim that anyone is beyond help entirely, but it might be impractical to try and save absolutely every case with a limited number of resources and time. Life may be more of a triage scenario where you need to try and save who you can. I can't say.

But I don't see the benefits of the feeling of hate outweighing the benefits of a clear mind. It may come naturally to people, but it isn't necessarily the most helpful one.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529387

>>529385
>pic of that Australian guy
Oh, that's an ancient meme!

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529388

>>529386
>It may come naturally to people, but it isn't necessarily the most helpful one.
Do you think that it was useful in our evolutionary past?

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529389

File: 1620094606937.png (721.1 KB, 1080x1080, gphgdccov.png)

>>529388

Sure, it serves a purpose. That doesn't mean we can't do better.

For example, our fight or flight response helped us to survive in our past, and engages still under situations of duress such as combat. But ask yourself, is it better to experience all of what the response does to us physiologically, or might a calmer, more objective mind give you an advantage over your opponent? Instead of being totally jacked up on adrenaline, you can think out your moves more easily and execute them with increased precision.

The mind that is rushing with madness, fear, or hatred is one that can be misled and deceived most easily.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529390

File: 1620095201390.jpg (123.49 KB, 1280x720, madoka-2011-03-11-105824.jpg)

>>529389
>Instead of being totally jacked up on adrenaline, you can think out your moves more easily and execute them with increased precision.
Or even simply hold a handgun steady enough to get a brainshot on the meth-head running at you with a knife.
This post was edited by its author on .

!Slavshit.Y (ID: 147c0a)Country code: anarchomonarchism.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529391

File: 1620095228452.png (706.51 KB, 1183x601, aww naw.png)

>>529390

That too.

Macaroni (Mobile) !RevGiOKgRo (ID: a8d7b5)Country code: pittsburgh.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529393

File: 1620095781414.jpg (146.49 KB, 600x400, 54ea7cb3-e160-4773-9787-f5a3b3…)

>>529389
What about having lasting hatred for the perpetrators of horrific crimes, such that we feel deeply motivated to enforce a strong correction against whatever enabled them?

Jiggle!Dick2STbYY (ID: 95ccc2)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529394

File: 1620095881985.png (548.13 KB, 567x800, susie_dd1iiy4-4cf073a6-dbb7-4a…)

Evil is good.

Spread evil.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529395

File: 1620096085700.png (915.41 KB, 588x848, 1507015740276.png)

>>529393
I'd say that more rational thought and less emotion would do well in that area. Things always seems to go wrong in public policy when emotions cloud rational thought. Empathizing with the victims is probably more important that hating the perps.

Valkyrie!ghostMcm7s (ID: 81d226)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529396

File: 1620096168558.jpg (24.17 KB, 255x265, 71E5FF8E-4B50-4EEE-8869-C6EDD3…)

>>529394
Developing a conscience is the first step to a better world. I've seem evil before. It's still hidden in me somewhere...

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529397

File: 1620096204292.mp4 (Spoiler Image, 609.6 KB, 720x576, iSFQ1ry.mp4)

>>529394
Butter is good.

Spread butter.

But make sure to soften it first!

Jiggle!Dick2STbYY (ID: 95ccc2)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529398

File: 1620096664016.jpg (978.92 KB, 3141x3518, horse_EoW2LzrXIAImKEk.jpg)

>>529396
The self-fettered shall perish from the earth.

And one should help them to it.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529399

>>529398
What you think of margarine?

Valkyrie!ghostMcm7s (ID: 81d226)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529400

File: 1620096952521.jpg (94.49 KB, 800x593, A7663354-360E-466D-BDE9-0CFE8B…)

>>529398
...Or maybe a better world is too difficult due to limitations and creating a wonderland is more desirable.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529401

>>529400
Do you like olive oil?

Valkyrie!ghostMcm7s (ID: 81d226)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529402

File: 1620097743105.jpg (94.49 KB, 800x593, 2976CD28-0BAE-4A93-89D0-DB81D5…)

>>529401
I like multivitamins and wonderlands.

Suomi Sauna !Wall.AT/L2 (ID: 2cd5cd)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529403

>>529402
Multivitamins are okay. But Wonderbread is SHIT. If you must eat bread, go with traditional bread from a local bakery.

Valkyrie!ghostMcm7s (ID: 81d226)Country code: us, country type: geoip, valid: 1  529404

File: 1620099528114.jpg (87.62 KB, 511x582, 0B1D1845-EADF-4D8A-91D2-1C381C…)

>>529403
No. I meant wonderland as in an imaginary place of delicate beauty or magical charm.

Toybox(Professional Slut)!!Celestia (ID: 89ae6f)Country code: amsterdam.png, country type: customflag, valid: 1  529425

File: 1620105576382.png (350.46 KB, 1202x676, E0f6YfPXMAgOSCB.png)

>>529394
I found the picture that perfectly encapsulates your worldview.


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